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Flex to Water heater
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Re: Flex to Water heater By  rcurrah

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 1:21:00 PM

Check out 2003 IFGC section 411- Appliance connections


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  darcar

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 1:26:00 PM

I do not have that code book available. Can you please quote?

Thanks


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  rcurrah

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 1:53:00 PM

411.1 Connecting appliances. Appliances shall be connected to the piping system by one of the following:
1. Rigid mettallic pipe and fittings.
2. Semirigid metallic tubing and metallic fittings. Lengths shall not exceed 6 feet and shall be located entirely in the same room as the appliance. Semirigid metallic tubing shall not enter a motor-operated appliance through an unprotected knockout opening.
3. Listed and labeled appliance connectors installed in accordance with the manufacturers installation instructions and located entirely in the same room as the appliance.
.....

411.1.2 Appliance fuel connectors. Connectors shall have an overall length not to exceed 3 feet, except for range and domestic clothesdryer connectors, which shall not exceed 6 feet in length. Connectors shall not be concealed within, or extend through, walls, floors, partitions, ceilings or appliance housings. A shutoff valve not less than the nominal sizeof the connector shall be installed ahead of the connector in accordance with section 409.5. Connectors shall be sized to provide total demand of the connected appliance.

There is more to that section, but I hope this is enough to keep you going.


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  darcar

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 2:16:00 PM

Excuse me for being ignorant on this, but why would the length of semirigid (flex) be limited to 6foot in length. Isn''t it true that an entire house can be piped with Tracpipe (brand name) which is flex (semirigid)? Does appliance include water heaters or is this refering more to stoves and dryers etc?

I''m not understanding the limitations.

I understand the reason for wanting a shutoff valve within the same room, but...


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  rcurrah

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 2:19:00 PM

You will have to seek that information from a higher source. There is a lot in the code books that I am yet to understand. Just enforce is my requirements.


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  hearthman

Posts: 0

1/11/2007 3:45:00 PM

Don''t confuse CSST such as Trac Pipe, Gastite, etc. with flexible appliance connectors listed to ANSI Z21.24. CSST is a listed fuel gas piping system and therefore can be used even in concealed spaces.

Flex appliance connectors are exactly that---they connect appliances to gas piping. Since anything longer than 6 feet would be a trip hazard, that''s one limit. The Code also wants real fuel gas piping within 6 feet of the appliance. They don''t want these flex connectors running through floors and walls because they are not tested or listed for that application the way CSST is. Stoves and dryers need more hose so you can pull the appliance out for service hence the 6 ft. rule. Otherwise, everything else is limtited to a reasonable 3 ft. You cannot splice connectors and you should use that mfr''s connectors to piping. Yes, water heaters, furnaces, dryers, stoves, fireplaces are all "appliances".

To better understand the gas code, get the IFGC Commentary instead of just the code. Contains the full code plus rationale behind certain sections.

BTW, if you are going to use a flex. appliance connector on a water heater, it must be sized for it, you still need the sediment trap and shut off within 6 feet.

HTH


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  dsjtecserv

Posts: 0

1/12/2007 4:08:00 AM

What hearthman said. Also "semirigid tubing" is copper tubing. Both flexible connctors and CSST are entirely different from semirigid tubing.

Dave


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  rcurrah

Posts: 0

1/12/2007 6:11:00 AM

Is there any other material besides copper tubing that can be considered " semirigid tubing " ?


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  dsjtecserv

Posts: 0

1/12/2007 6:28:00 AM

Its pretty much a 1 to 1 use of the term. Hearthman, do you know of any material other than copper that falls under that category? (that is used for gas piping.)


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  hearthman

Posts: 0

1/12/2007 10:50:00 AM

Dave, there is annealed 300 series stainless tubing for use with Sta-Lok fittings used in industrial applications but rarely seen in residential or even commercial. I asked the Rep. if I could use the stainless for the oil lines to my boiler and he responded heartily it was approved for gas and oil. Hmmm, other than cost, I wonder why it isn''t more widely used? I think he said their fittings were tested to 5 psi. I''ll check on it some more and report back.


Even within copper, you need to know what type it is. Usually you can only use types ''K'', ''L'', or AC/R refridgeration tubing IF.... the local gas utility can assure you there is less than 0.4 grains of hydrogen sulphide per 100 cu.ft. Also, the copper must be coated outside for protection. Flare fittings are not approved for use in concealed spaces the way CSST is and you don''t put pipe dope on flares. You can download a free copy of the Copper Tubing Manual at [URL=http://www.copper.org]www.copper.org[/URL]

With all gas piping, I would recommend tend to oversize rather than undersize. In homes with high BTU loads, you need to consider a 12.2 wci or 2 psi system. You want any Medium Pressure (MP) regulators as close to the appliances as possible, paying attention to your local codes on venting the reg.

When moving into a new house, never reuse those flexible appliance connectors for the dryer or stove. Replace them.

When pressure testing for gas leaks, you need to disconnect all applainecs and cap the lines any time you test over 14 wci, which is 1/2 psi. You cannot rely on shutoffs and there is a very real possibility of valve damage. I''ve investigated dozens of these cases with many more suspected. One problem with high pressure testing is if a tech comes to start up a unit with the house still pressurized and opens the cock blowing the diaphragmn in the valve. If the test is left unattended, there needs to be signs placed at each shutoff and meter.

Thanks for covering me on the "semi-rigid" part Dave! I was focusing on Z21.24 connectors vs/ LC-1 CSST.

Sorry for the ramble.
HTH,
Hearthman


   

Re: Flex to Water heater By  DaveW

Posts: 0

1/12/2007 5:20:00 PM

appliance connectors 3 feet unless range or dryer then 6 feet maximum.


   

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